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Re: Back to basics – testing your hypothesis.
Posted by: Jim Mazerat (IP Logged)
Date: January 22, 2007 06:36PM

I am sure you are aware that hundreds of thousands of people have been convicted based on testimony from an expert on fingerprints. Do you remember the case of Brandon Mayfield, an Oregon lawyer, spent two weeks in jail in 2004 because three FBI experts matched his prints with those found on a plastic bag that was evidence in the investigation of the Madrid train bombings. He is grateful the Spanish authorities did not accept the FBI’s findings as fact but continued to try to match the prints after the FBI arrested Mayfield and eventually linked them to an Algerian man. Does this mean there are two persons with the same print, or is there a problem with the identification methodology being used. Today examiners primarily rely on matching points on both prints where ridges end, bifurcate, or change direction. Examiners conclude a crime scene print came from a suspect after matching between three and sixteen points (FBI examiners found 15 points on Mayfield’s print). But there are no nationally reconized standards on the number of points that must be matched. Instead each lab, and sometimes each examiner, determines the number needed. If you complain about there being not accepted standard between the fire investigators,how do you now feel about the fingerprint expert that can send you to jail.

One known flaw in fingerprinting is that examiners may taint the identification process through bias and peer pressure. A panel of outside print examiners convened by the FBI to review the Mayfield case found that a supervisor made the initial identification and lower-ranking examiners, when asked to confirm or reject their boss’ work, felt pressured to confirm. Having FBI supervisors make the initial identifications was not unusual, according to Alan McRoberts, a retired Los Angeles County Sheriff’s Department examiner and chair of the review panel, and other agencies do it as well. But while this practice resulted in one wrongful arrest, the panel did not recommend the FBI review other cases. “As a committee, I don’t think we discussed that in particular,” said McRoberts.

All I am trying to say is that with our system there are many imperfections. I am not saying we should except anything less than the best but to only accept perfect may be saying there is nothing we can accept.

By the way, I do like the fact that you Denny and others here strive to reach the higher level of certainty.



Subject Views Written By Posted
  Back to basics – testing your hypothesis. 2249 Russaus 01/11/2007 08:08AM
  Re: Back to basics – testing your hypothesis. 1316 cda 01/11/2007 08:38AM
  Re: Back to basics – testing your hypothesis. 1240 Russaus 01/11/2007 08:49AM
  Re: Back to basics – testing your hypothesis. 1218 cda 01/11/2007 10:05AM
  Re: Back to basics – testing your hypothesis. 1317 dcarpenter 01/11/2007 11:38AM
  Re: Back to basics – testing your hypothesis. 1239 greggorbett 01/12/2007 02:58AM
  Re: Back to basics – testing your hypothesis. 1233 dsmith 01/21/2007 03:47PM
  Re: Back to basics – testing your hypothesis. 1256 Jim Mazerat 01/21/2007 07:17PM
  Re: Back to basics – testing your hypothesis. 1312 Gerald Hurst 01/21/2007 09:30PM
  Re: Back to basics – testing your hypothesis. 1129 MIJ 01/21/2007 10:28PM
  Re: Back to basics – testing your hypothesis. 1043 Jim Mazerat 01/22/2007 12:12PM
  Re: Back to basics – testing your hypothesis. 1217 Gerald Hurst 01/22/2007 01:41PM
  Re: Back to basics – testing your hypothesis. 1180 Jim Mazerat 01/22/2007 02:36PM
  Re: Back to basics – testing your hypothesis. 1107 Gerald Hurst 01/22/2007 04:15PM
  Re: Back to basics – testing your hypothesis. 1052 MIJ 01/22/2007 04:17PM
  Re: Back to basics – testing your hypothesis. 1188 Gerald Hurst 01/22/2007 04:35PM
  Re: Back to basics – testing your hypothesis. 1113 MIJ 01/22/2007 05:36PM
  Re: Back to basics – testing your hypothesis. 1137 Jim Mazerat 01/22/2007 06:36PM
  Re: Back to basics – testing your hypothesis. 1071 Jim Mazerat 01/22/2007 06:05PM
  Re: Back to basics – testing your hypothesis. 1199 MIKE 01/22/2007 07:55PM
  Re: Back to basics – testing your hypothesis. 1240 Jim Mazerat 01/22/2007 06:12PM
  Re: Back to basics – testing your hypothesis. 1055 MIJ 01/22/2007 11:33PM
  Re: Back to basics – testing your hypothesis. 1063 Jim Mazerat 01/23/2007 10:31AM
  Re: Back to basics – testing your hypothesis. 1163 PMK140 01/11/2007 11:35AM
  Re: Back to basics – testing your hypothesis. 1220 dcarpenter 01/11/2007 11:15AM
  Re: Back to basics – testing your hypothesis. 1247 dcarpenter 01/11/2007 11:13AM
  Re: Back to basics – testing your hypothesis. 1053 cda 01/11/2007 12:12PM
  Re: Back to basics – testing your hypothesis. 1300 dcarpenter 01/11/2007 01:14PM
  Re: Back to basics – testing your hypothesis. 1135 dcarpenter 01/11/2007 10:39AM
  Re: Back to basics – testing your hypothesis. 1281 Gerald Hurst 01/11/2007 11:21AM
  Re: Back to basics – testing your hypothesis. 1135 PMK140 01/11/2007 11:41AM
  Re: Back to basics – testing your hypothesis. 1081 cda 01/12/2007 03:00AM
  Re: Back to basics – testing your hypothesis. 1108 MIJ 01/12/2007 07:02AM
  Re: Back to basics – testing your hypothesis. 1100 cda 01/12/2007 08:17AM
  Re: Back to basics – testing your hypothesis. 1164 MIJ 01/12/2007 09:02AM
  Re: Back to basics – testing your hypothesis. 1154 MIJ 01/12/2007 09:07AM
  Re: Back to basics – testing your hypothesis. 1077 Jim Mazerat 01/17/2007 11:48AM
  Re: Back to basics – testing your hypothesis. 1304 dsmith 01/21/2007 04:14PM
  Re: Back to basics – testing your hypothesis. 1220 Jim Mazerat 01/21/2007 07:34PM
  Re: Back to basics – testing your hypothesis. 1140 SJAvato 01/22/2007 12:51PM
  Re: Back to basics – testing your hypothesis. 1049 MIJ 01/22/2007 02:06PM
  Re: Back to basics – testing your hypothesis. 972 Jim Mazerat 01/22/2007 02:53PM
  Re: Back to basics – testing your hypothesis. 1025 cda 01/12/2007 08:20AM
  Re: Back to basics – testing your hypothesis. 1201 MIJ 01/12/2007 09:30AM
  Re: Back to basics – testing your hypothesis. 1092 cda 01/12/2007 09:54AM
  Re: Back to basics – testing your hypothesis. 1128 MIJ 01/12/2007 10:00AM
  Re: Back to basics – testing your hypothesis. 1237 Jim Mazerat 01/12/2007 10:26AM
  Re: Back to basics – testing your hypothesis. 1304 The Oracle 01/16/2007 07:02AM
  Re: Back to basics – testing your hypothesis. 1223 dsmith 01/21/2007 03:40PM
  Re: Back to basics – testing your hypothesis. 1233 Jim Mazerat 01/21/2007 07:41PM
  Re: Back to basics – testing your hypothesis. 1224 Tim Pullen 01/16/2007 08:40AM
  Re: Back to basics – testing your hypothesis. 1200 MIJ 01/16/2007 10:06AM
  Re: Back to basics – testing your hypothesis. 1094 Jim Mazerat 01/17/2007 06:33AM
  Re: Back to basics –MIJ: Please give it a rest 1302 John J. Lentini, CFEI 01/17/2007 07:42AM
  Re: Back to basics –MIJ: Please give it a rest 1190 MIJ 01/17/2007 10:10AM
  Re: Back to basics –MIJ: Please give it a rest 1210 Jim Mazerat 01/17/2007 11:54AM
  Re: Back to basics –MIJ: Please give it a rest 1140 MIJ 01/17/2007 03:52PM
  Re: Back to basics –MIJ: Please give it a rest 1245 Jim Mazerat 01/17/2007 04:31PM
  Re: Back to basics Still can't rest 1151 MIJ 01/17/2007 06:20PM
  Re: Back to basics Still can't rest 1285 Jim Mazerat 01/18/2007 10:32AM
  Re: Back to basics - grammar police 1247 jmorse 01/21/2007 03:45PM
  Re: Back to basics - grammar police 1042 Jim Mazerat 01/21/2007 07:18PM
  Re: Testing a hypothesis 1132 Jim Mazerat 01/22/2007 12:20PM
  Re: Testing a hypothesis 1253 SJAvato 01/22/2007 12:56PM
  Re: Testing a hypothesis 1072 Jim Mazerat 01/22/2007 12:58PM
  Re: Testing a hypothesis 1162 MIJ 01/22/2007 02:23PM
  Re: Testing a hypothesis 1099 Jim Mazerat 01/22/2007 02:46PM


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