Fire/Arson Investigations :  Fire/Arson Investigations The fastest message board... ever.
A place to ask questions and add to probative and informative discussions associated with the various aspects of the field of fire investigation. -- FORUM RULES---BE CIVIL AND NO NAME CALLING, NO BELITTLING, NO BERATING, NO DENIGRATING others. Postings in violation of these rules can be removed or editted to remove the offending remarks at the discretion of the moderators and/or site administrator. 
Re: 921 Level of Certainty
Posted by: J L Mazerat (IP Logged)
Date: April 07, 2022 10:34AM

When it comes to the level of certainty, there is no one that is completely right or wrong that has posted here on this subject. One of the best articles, that include some research and testing, can be found at:
[www.researchgate.net]

This article gives information on the subject that is important to the individual that believes or does not believe in using the term with a degree of certainty.

I was talking with a person last night about this subject. What was related to me I thought was interesting. It showed how an investigator can get caught up it the term to where in trying to defend it he ended up not being able to testify. He went along the lines of the discussion that has taken place here on the site. He said he used the scientific method found in 921. He was then asked if that methodology produced a level of certainty as to the correctness of his opinion. He then when into the falsification discussion of the scientific method. He was asked if because that methodology could not say his opinion was correct. He was then asked if he had a level of certainty that his opinion was correct. He answered yes. Of course, the next question was what the level was. The investigator reverted to 921 and said it was probable. He was then asked what percentage does probable mean. He said more than 50 precent. He was then asked does that mean you have almost a 50 precent chance of your answer being wrong. In trying to get out of this he said his opinion was more than the 50 precent. Next question was what percentage it is. This questioning went on for a while to the point the judge cut off the questioning and ruled the investigator was not qualified to give the opinion. The judge’s reasoning was that if he could not explain how his methodology would result in a correct answer as to how the fire started and he seem not wanting to give it a high degree of certainty of being correct that his testimony is nothing more than speculation.

What would be best is to remove the line of questioning. As to the level of certainty this was done by the Justice Department when they instructed that the term level of certainty was to no longer appear in reports. Unfortunately, this did not address the falsification issue in the scientific method. I’m sure we will see that challenged somewhere soon. Attorneys are getting smarter by the day and I’m listening to experts as to how to challenge other experts.

Here is something you may want to consider and be able to explain before attempting to give testimony. Ask yourself these questions. You may even want to practice the answers. In formulating my opinions, did I consider all relevant facts? Do I have adequate understanding of pertinent scientific principles used in the formulation of the opinion? Did I use methods of assessment that are appropriate, reliable, and valid? Can I explain the methodology used to conduct the investigation and reach a conclusion? Are my inferences, assumptions, and conclusions reasonable and defensible?

Jim Mazerat
Forensic Investigations Group



Subject Views Written By Posted
  921 Level of Certainty 558 J L Mazerat 03/01/2022 10:41AM
  Re: 921 Level of Certainty 322 J L Mazerat 03/03/2022 08:27AM
  Re: 921 Level of Certainty 346 dcarpenter 03/03/2022 10:28AM
  Re: 921 Level of Certainty 326 J L Mazerat 03/04/2022 09:52AM
  Re: 921 Level of Certainty 311 dcarpenter 03/10/2022 11:50AM
  Re: 921 Level of Certainty 290 J L Mazerat 03/12/2022 09:10AM
  Re: 921 Level of Certainty 282 dcarpenter 03/14/2022 02:54PM
  Re: 921 Level of Certainty 266 J L Mazerat 03/15/2022 10:06AM
  Re: 921 Level of Certainty 274 dcarpenter 03/15/2022 07:27PM
  Re: 921 Level of Certainty 268 J L Mazerat 03/16/2022 12:58PM
  Re: 921 Level of Certainty 264 dcarpenter 03/17/2022 02:35PM
  Re: 921 Level of Certainty 259 J L Mazerat 03/18/2022 09:07AM
  Re: 921 Level of Certainty 261 dcarpenter 03/18/2022 10:51AM
  Re: 921 Level of Certainty 262 J L Mazerat 03/19/2022 12:06PM
  Re: 921 Level of Certainty 254 dcarpenter 03/21/2022 10:42AM
  Re: 921 Level of Certainty 233 J L Mazerat 03/21/2022 05:09PM
  Re: 921 Level of Certainty 237 dcarpenter 03/22/2022 08:46AM
  Re: 921 Level of Certainty 234 dcarpenter 03/22/2022 09:00AM
  Re: 921 Level of Certainty 231 J L Mazerat 03/22/2022 11:48AM
  Re: 921 Level of Certainty 244 J L Mazerat 03/22/2022 11:41AM
  Re: 921 Level of Certainty 235 dcarpenter 03/22/2022 01:16PM
  Re: 921 Level of Certainty 236 J L Mazerat 03/22/2022 02:32PM
  Re: 921 Level of Certainty 256 J L Mazerat 03/19/2022 09:37AM
  Re: 921 Level of Certainty 292 dcarpenter 03/19/2022 10:04AM
  Re: 921 Level of Certainty 253 J L Mazerat 03/19/2022 08:30PM
  Re: 921 Level of Certainty 254 dcarpenter 03/21/2022 10:47AM
  Re: 921 Level of Certainty 241 J L Mazerat 03/21/2022 05:16PM
  Re: 921 Level of Certainty 249 dcarpenter 03/22/2022 08:56AM
  Re: 921 Level of Certainty 242 J L Mazerat 03/22/2022 11:45AM
  Re: 921 Level of Certainty 260 dcarpenter 03/22/2022 01:21PM
  Re: 921 Level of Certainty 239 J L Mazerat 03/22/2022 02:36PM
  Re: 921 Level of Certainty 243 dcarpenter 03/22/2022 03:18PM
  Re: 921 Level of Certainty 235 J L Mazerat 03/22/2022 05:41PM
  Re: 921 Level of Certainty 243 J L Mazerat 03/22/2022 07:35PM
  Re: 921 Level of Certainty 268 J L Mazerat 03/20/2022 10:40AM
  Re: 921 Level of Certainty 271 cda 03/20/2022 08:27PM
  Re: 921 Level of Certainty 263 J L Mazerat 03/21/2022 08:32PM
  Re: 921 Level of Certainty 251 cda 03/22/2022 09:54AM
  Re: 921 Level of Certainty 251 J L Mazerat 03/23/2022 10:57AM
  Re: 921 Level of Certainty 259 CJN 03/23/2022 08:54PM
  Re: 921 Level of Certainty 257 dcarpenter 03/29/2022 08:26AM
  Re: 921 Level of Certainty 257 dcarpenter 03/29/2022 08:31AM
  Re: 921 Level of Certainty 246 J L Mazerat 03/29/2022 10:55AM
  Re: 921 Level of Certainty 250 J L Mazerat 03/29/2022 10:51AM
  Re: 921 Level of Certainty 263 John Lentini 03/31/2022 03:38PM
  Re: 921 Level of Certainty 268 J L Mazerat 03/31/2022 06:57PM
  Re: 921 Level of Certainty 268 John Lentini 04/01/2022 10:12AM
  Re: 921 Level of Certainty 239 J L Mazerat 04/08/2022 08:37AM
  Re: 921 Level of Certainty 264 J L Mazerat 03/24/2022 02:47PM
  Re: 921 Level of Certainty 257 J L Mazerat 04/07/2022 10:34AM


Sorry, only registered users may post in this forum.
This forum powered by Phorum.